Spark and Go Wild: Part 1

Terri Novacek 

Imagine your brain working at its highest capacity. With reduced tension, depression and anxiety, and a higher level of energy. You've got all cylinders firing, and you are ready to take on whatever comes your way

Terri Novacek 

Hello, and thank you for listening to the Element Is Everything podcast, where we discuss the science and practice of discovering and developing your element, that place where interests and talents collide, to do great things for yourself and others. I'm Terra Nova check and I look forward to sharing with you today an interview I had with Best Selling Author and Doctor of psychiatry, John J. Ratey. MD. Dr. Ratey is the author of the best selling book Spark, the revolutionary new science of exercise and the brain. If you're a regular listener, then you likely remember me talking about his work. In a former episode. Dr. Ratey also co wrote Go Wild in which he shared what he refers to as an evolutions rules for total health and well being. This episode, which will be part one of the interview will focus on Spark and exercise with part two coming out at the end of the week and focusing on go wild and the other lovers of wellness. Let's jump right in. Thank you so much for making the time I'm really excited to talk to you. And I feel like I could talk to you for hours and hours and hours because there's so many topics, but I'm going to try to narrow it down.

Dr. Ratey 

Good. So what what are you? What is this?

Terri Novacek 

Element education is a nonprofit that runs to charter schools that operate throughout San Diego County. So what is it like K eight Montessori that has five locations? And then the other one is a personalized learning hybrid program. There's also a homeschool track, and that's throughout the county as well. The idea behind finding your element I'm not sure if you're familiar with Sir Ken Robinson's work. That's really what where we got our name was just the idea of taking responsibility for your own learning and, and letting learning be natural. Yeah. And, and so that's where your work becomes important to us is especially in in Spark, I think that well, we all know, by the rates, the obesity rates and the depression and anxiety and I mean, every nobody will argue, you know, that. Oh, I went and exercised and I felt horrible, you know. But yeah, we still don't do it.

Dr. Ratey 

Right. Right, right. Yeah, no, there's, there's such resistance to even acknowledging what the benefits are for people, you know, like the University of Michigan has been studying, what motivation will keep people at it. And their wisdom accumulated over many years of study is you have to acknowledge and remember how you feel the day that you exercise. In other words, don't look at it as a long term project, like I'm going to lose weight, or I'm going to get buff, or I'm going to develop more endurance, or whatever it is. Look at it, oh, how do I feel right after I exercise in that day, and especially looking at whether you're more productive, or you're more with it, or you're more motivated. All those things that we know, happen after you exercise. It's that is the magic is to get people to acknowledge and remember, so that that can be its own motivation. My journey is, is a long one. But and I hate to even think of that, but it's been a long journey. And especially when it comes to our topic today. Exercise. I grew up being all sports, Western Pennsylvania, tough area, steel mill father kind of blue collar grow up. And part of the job as its as a kid was to develop a sport. So you could go to college, you could get a scholarship. That was a that was the idea along with doing well in school, but anyway, so I played all the sports And then focused eventually on tennis, because no one else was doing it that, that we became pretty good and play the Nationals and then scholarship, college and all that. So that's how I got into it. And I realized how important it was. And when I stopped exercising, I also realized how anxious and depressed I would get, or could get, especially breaking an arm and didn't exercise for a while and then got back into it and realize, hey, I'm so much better when I exercise in every way, you know. And so then in medical school, there was this article in the throwaway journal about a hospital in in Norway, that at that time, we had these wonderful new drugs called antidepressants that really worked. And everybody was using them and beginning to this hospital in Norway, taking in these depressed patients, and they offered them the medicine or an exercise program. And the results were the same for both. So this foot that germ in my head, that exercise was really, really important, then and, and throughout my training, I paid attention to that. And in psychiatry was even more important because of its antidepressant, anti anxiety, anti stress effects, and soon learned about its anti addiction effects. Then came that focus on ADHD and a the effective exercise on our attention system, and our ability to learn or cog and not only the emotional benefits, but the cognitive benefits that we get from exercise. So all through my first couple of decades as a as a psychiatrists and writing books on the brain and how the brain works. And for now for books on attention deficit disorder, always focusing eventually on the benefits of exercise a physical exercise to keep our brain running the best it can. And then I discovered this school system in Naperville, Illinois that takes up the first chapter of Spark. And I couldn't believe it, I just couldn't believe that this school existed, that they had this incredible group of PE teachers who revolutionized physical education as far as I was concerned, who looked to get their kids more fit, more physically fit. And with that came them being among the smartest kids in the world on the various tests that they took, but the Jim's test, evaluating countries across the world on how they're doing in basically math and science. And they came in number one on the World Science and number six in math. Whereas the US as a whole was in the late teens behind all the Asian countries in Finland.

Terri Novacek 

If I remember right, then they attribute that to their PE program. But it was also was it zero hour? Or what did they call the? Yeah,

Dr. Ratey 

that's the first the beginning of the first chapter Zero Hour was only one aspect of what they did. Zero was for those kids who had learning problems, reading problems, to be specific, because they had a learning readiness course for ninth graders. And zero hour was to have these kids come in an hour early to do to do their PE class, before they took their reading readiness course. It really was sort of a revolution in my mind to see that they, for instance, reading readiness course, the kids that came in to exercise before they took the course doubled their progress as compared to those that didn't participate. But the whole program at Naperville was was changed not just that small area. But what they eventually evolved to where 90,000 kids were going 45 minutes a day in fitness base exercise. And that's where the magic was, not only were they among the fittest in the country, in terms of at that point there and the reason why I learned about them because their obesity rate was almost nil, but their overweight scores were at three are sent. And there 19,000 Kids in the district all of whom were involved in this new PE program.

Terri Novacek 

You mentioned Fitness based exercise,

Dr. Ratey 

what they did first they had kids run, do calisthenics workout, and then they added support back into their program, but kept it so everybody was participating all the time, what they called Small sided sports. So there was 2123 on three boards, and no one chose teams, it was all computer generated every day. And what one brilliant intervention a couple of years into this was realizing that the really unathletic kids had to work harder. So they slept on these heartrate monitors, and decided that you're going to get your grade by the amount of time you spend in your cardiac training zone. And this was remarkable, because kids that look like they were just dogging it, and yet their heart rate was way up in the cardiac training zone, because these kids were basically not very fit and the rise to being fit was important. And this is where the heart rate then became something that they measured as a way to evaluate kids. And what we found subsequent to that is that heart rate is a good measure of how much exercise you're doing in general. And you want to get your heart rate up to that what's called the cardiac training zone, if you're if you can, which is moderate to vigorous exercise, but even so people that are just starting, they're going to get there pretty quick, you know, get get to that level pretty quick, because they're not fit. And as you develop your fitness, you get better and better and better and better.

Terri Novacek 

Well, it certainly makes more sense and would be more motivating than, you know, run a five minute mile.

Dr. Ratey 

Exactly, exactly. So that this is was the exact thought of these PE teachers who were doing it really to raise the level of fitness of their kids. And with that, at the same time, then introduced sport, and all the other facets of physical education. So that eventually, when I came on the scene, like 1020 years into their revolution, basically, they were winning state titles in different sports, because they had more athletes to choose from. So because all the kids were fit, they were all part of this broke program to increase their endurance, increase their muscle mass, increase their strength, and as well as coordination, thinking on the move kind of thing that sport gives you. So that it, it really led to the huge change in the school. And, you know, I spent the first chapter talking about the wonders of Naperville, because it was really a game changer for me.

Terri Novacek 

And so your practice was in psychiatry.

Dr. Ratey 

Yes, I'm a psychiatrist still is.

Terri Novacek 

And I know that you have done a lot of work with addiction and violence and add, is that accurate?

Dr. Ratey 

That's very accurate. I started about treating most aggressive people in the world, in the hospitals and in the prisons, and so forth. And then I led led me to add, because most of these kids and adults even we're at a history of learning problems.

Terri Novacek 

And so would you prescribe exercise?

Dr. Ratey 

Absolutely. You know, I add books, we braise exercise, there's all kinds of stuff to do for someone with attention deficit disorder, but medicine, structure, understanding, getting people to find their element if you will find their best self and go with it. But along with all that is exercise, physical movement, balance coordination. So think yoga, think best exercise, perhaps, is dance. When you think of all the benefits to the brain of dance. Huge. And then you think of martial arts. Certainly tumbling and then running, walking, biking, swimming, sailing, surfing, for where you guys are at. What a wonderful sport that is to the brain. Oh, Lord.

Terri Novacek 

I know in gGo Wild, you You talk a lot about being out in the wild and you you guys have that wonderful story of running on the mountain and I think That's really a feeling to a certain crowd. Like somebody like me, I read that. And I think, Oh, that's great. But I know that there's people that would read that and think that is not the least bit interesting to me. That would be like somebody telling me, hey, let's sit down and play video games for two hours. So the difference being is, being outdoors and getting the exercise is actually healthier for you. What have you found to be helpful when you're working with people that are not naturally drawn? to that?

Dr. Ratey 

Well, that's a very important question, the trail running is great. But if you're an outdoors exercise, you know, then you then you can appreciate that. But what I think it's so important for the general populace is for them to be aware of the effect of any exercise on the brain. And so that's why I say, well, a big motivator is reading spark, and seeing all the things that the effects of exercise on the brain, on our hormones on our neurotransmitters on our brain cells. And when people begin to see that, and say, Oh, this is why it feels so different after I've exercise. And it doesn't take much. You know, I mean, a 10 minute walk, and people come back, and they're less stress, or jump rope, which is hugely wonderful exercise. Oh, my God, very important for kids, and adults, but kids for sure. Because it's a quick way to get your heart rate up to get to challenge your coordination and your balance, and rhythm and all that there's probably no better way to spend five minutes than jumping rope.

Terri Novacek 

I know with smartwatches these days, I believe all of them have the capability. And if they don't, there's apps that can measure heart rate. Do you know much about them? Are they accurate? Is it worth it? Motivating

Dr. Ratey 

work and show you mine? My Fitbit, well, back when we rode Spark, in starting, there were there was the Garmin and the polar watches, that's what we had, they were very expensive. And now you can get a heart rate monitor for your wrist for about 10 bucks, I think, you know, you get the bare bones. But even even this Fitbit, which I found to be better than the Apple Watch, when I got an Apple Watch for a while the in terms of heart rate monitoring that took a while for the Apple Watch to get to see the change. Whereas this Fitbit is really quick. And it's less than $100, this Fitbit, and it does all the fitness things. It evaluates your heart rate, or monitors your heart rate and your step count. And all that then while you're awake while you're moving. So it gives you how many steps you've done today, in putting it into your ever present phone that then stores it and let you see how you did today versus yesterday, etc. Also measures your sleep time. And all that. I mean, it's wonderful. It's amazing. It's an amazing tool. And Are they accurate? Close? They're close personnel. Yeah, that's all you need. You don't need most people don't need that kind of precision and you know, but they're very close.

Terri Novacek 

Now anxiety is that, is that something you've worked a lot with?

Dr. Ratey 

Yes, very much.

Terri Novacek 

 I feel like that. It may be that's just in my world, but especially after COVID I I'm just seeing higher rates of it in in not only children but adults.

Dr. Ratey 

Sure. Yeah. COVID has really changed our world and made us more sedentary. You know, I think in general, that's what's happened. More computer addicted, not that we weren't before but we're now even more so. Like now we're talking on Zoom rather than on a you know, face to face or in the same space. But this has led to a couple of things. One, we're not as physically connected to one to another which is hugely important in all of our books along with exercise. In fact, even before exercise, being connected to another person, being involved socially with another group or another person is the probably the pinnacle of, of health promotion. But along with that is movement and moving to reduce anxiety. I mean, in Spark, the second chapter is on stress. And oh exercise really works to help us deal with stress how it changes our brain if you do it if you exercise chronically, and I use that word, but on a regular basis, if you exercise your brain will change your brain, it changes immediately when you exercise. But if you do it as a habit, your brain will be different. You will have different groups of nerve cells that are more populous that have more more, they're, they're more vigorous, so that this will eventually lead to you being more resistant to stressors, you won't get stressed by the same threat that you were before, it will be harder to get you into that anxious state, which precedes the fight or flight state or the panic state. It takes it takes a greater stressor to get you there. Again, in my book, third chapter, I think is on depression, and how exercise really is an antidepressant. And why looking at the change in in hormones. The change in our neurotransmitters that about of exercise is like taking a little bit of Ritalin and a little bit of Prozac. Because do the same thing elevates those neurotransmitters that are antidepressants in our stimulants rays. And this then leads to a better mood, a better focus and a better feeling of ease. You're more at ease with yourself after you exercise.

Terri Novacek 

You're more at ease with yourself. Wow, Sign me up. I remember a commercial in the 1970s with a catchy little tune. It was so catchy that I still remember it. It went something like this. Be wise exercise, move around, have some fun. Don't sit like a stone, get your muscles and tone, move it and you feel better. So why am I torturing you with this song? Just to demonstrate that the science of the human body remains the same when it comes to exercise. I tried to find the commercial on the internet, so I wouldn't have to sing it. But I did find others from the same era sharing the positive effects of exercise. So that was the 1970s. Fast forward to spark written in 2008. New technologies such as Fitbits and MRIs come on the scene. And they continue to support the science that says moving your body improves your brain. You'll find a 2021 article in our show notes from Harvard education that supports the benefits of exercise on the brain. Still today, advances in neuro imaging support what those commercials of the 1970s were trying to convey, move it and you'll feel better. Nothing makes you feel like you feel with exercise except exercise. As Dr. Ratey puts it. It's like a little bit of Ritalin and a little bit of Prozac. But here's why it is so much better. You don't have to rely on a doctor. You don't have to worry about missing a dose or taking your pills with you everywhere you go. So you can stay on schedule. You don't have the side effects, the headache, the dry mouth, insomnia, change in appetite, feeling sick or dizzy. In fact, you feel the opposite. Like any habit, you have to lay out a reasonable plan. If you're feeling motivated by what is being said here today, and you're not physically fit, do not go out and run a mile. Start with a walk, move up to a jog and so forth. You can reap the short term benefits of improved energy and focus with as little as five minutes of exercise a day. Everyone can find five minutes in their schedule. And with so many free resources available on the internet, we can have an exercise coach in our living room every day. There are programs for kids that you can put on while getting some work done. And programs for adults you can do before the kids get up in the morning. Remember how you feel the day you exercise. Remember how your child feels and behaves after exercise. Use that as your motivation to keep it up. And remember, every step you take, every move you make, can bring you clo